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Today I will be sharing Bank of New Zealand DevOps transformation experience with my CTO @paul_littlefair "Banking on Flow Metrics" - https://doeseurope2022.sched.com/event/11gDy/banking-on-flow-metrics-bank-of-new-zealand-transformation-journey?iframe=no looking forward to interacting with you all; Our first breakout session on track-1 today.
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Hello all, looking forward to interacting with you all here DOES22; Three days of immersive learning experience
Thank you @joseadanof - I, you , we belong to this inspiring, learning, sharing and caring DevOps community. THANK YOU BMK
⚡ It's a pleasure to welcome back @lbmkrishna, Value Stream Architect, and Paul Littlefair, Executive General Manager of Technology, from the Bank of New Zealand, here to talk about Banking on Flow Metrics ⚡
If you are wondering about the differences between different "time" in our DevOps cycle:
Tech Debt Report, this is interesting, what would be a good practice to measure and express it?
We follow our parent company NAB (National Australian Bank) for some of our tech debt reporting. Measuring based on "Data, Currency, Current State Architecture vs Target State Architecture"
The measure includes $$ value of how much we need to pay in principle and interest and "rework" to address the Tech Debt
Yes @rshoup - I need to strip of some of the "other" info; I will reach out to you later
"freed up a lot of cash and moved some people out of the way" :)))
"We see passionate people at DevOps Enterprise Summit - Leaders, practitioners, change agents, thought leaders" - by @paul_littlefair
Thanks for pointing out that you will start this journey with the wrong numbers and the wrong insights. We're seeing that now too!
@paul_littlefair & I have shared further our learnings, motivation with @mik https://projecttoproduct.org/podcast/bank-of-new-zealand/
Besides VSM architect how did you ensure team / businesses have someone who knows about VSM.
That is an interesting one @siddharth.pareek; The fact is that Business is also trying to solve the same problem in value delivery to customer. The fact is they were doing something in the similar lines of Value Stream mapping. Which made our life easy in few cases
Might not be in the full fledge VSM; but helped us start our 100 meters race from 50th meter
i think the internal drive makes all the difference, and we are in the space where people are required to learn on the own with a quick pace
VSM where M may stands for Mapping and Management. What you started first and how did you ensured they both run in parallel in later stages.
In fact in three steps: Identification, mapping and management
Want to go faster but 20th century processes are hindering you? Join my talk “From Milestones to a Continuous Quality Assurance Flow – Applying DevOps in Industrial Environments” starting in a few minutes in track 1. I look forward to your questions!
🌟 Coming up, let's welcome @peter.fassbinder, here to present From Milestones to a Continuous Quality Assurance Flow – Applying DevOps in Industrial Environments 🌟
Thank you all for joining @paul_littlefair & me here; Appreciated. Looking forward to share and talk more about Flow - if you are interested. Ping me here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bmknz/
Thanks @lbmkrishna and @paul_littlefair, great stuff! And I encourage everyone to take a look at your episode of Mik+One!
Interesting topic : Continuous Value Streams to Your Customers : Milestones to a Continuous Quality Assurance Flow – Applying DevOps in Industrial Environments by @peter.fassbinder - @annp - Track#1 seems like "Flow" and Value Stream 🙂
Continuous everything is key, but the different streams have to be setup and managed differently.
I really like the pragmatic approach for non-software artifacts. Something often forgotten in controlled environments and those become the bottlenecks either for deployments or from a adoption perspective
Does the term "Non-software artifact" resonates with you? Or how would you call it?
I don't want to call it regulatory artifacts, since these are only a subset of all non-software artifacts. Today I actually tend to use three terms: 1) Software itself, 2) Software-Close Artifacts (e.g. Requirements, Test Cases, Risks - those are today already managed in most cases in the ALM tool chain on a feature level) 3) Non-Software Artifacts - the ones mentioned in this talk.
Dankeschoen. Makes a lot of sense to me. Already thinking how to apply to my world!
For the same reason we call the new stream Continuous Conformance and not Continuous Compliance
Thanks for joining. If you want to dive deeper into those topics contact me either during the next two days at the DOES or at LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peter-fassbinder-3a8209194/
I am not in the DevOps field for that long, only 1.5 years and I have built the system from the ground up so experience for me was very different.
Main challenge for me was to bring older systems and applications to the DevOps and create CI/CD pipelines and processes for older apps built in VB6
It always starts bottom-up with a focus on the tool chain. But as @mcziomer mentioned "I really like the pragmatic approach for non-software artifacts. Something often forgotten in controlled environments and those become the bottlenecks either for deployments or from a adoption perspective". This applies at least to industrial and/or regulated companies. This bottleneck can be seen everywhere in these organizations.
What I also like is the idea of visualising data and providing it in a way that is conventient and accessible for everyone, be it builds or anything else. For example, having a dashboard with build graphs with detailed build times and changelogs provided on a click helps the whole team resolve issues when they arrive. Also, that data can be sent via e-mail or as a notificiation so there is always a way of viewing needed analytics in couple of seconds.
Thank you, @peter.fassbinder — it’s been amazing to see the evolution of this journey at Siemens!!! 🎉
You can also read more in @peter.fassbinder's paper in the new Spring 2022 DevOps Enterprise Journal here: https://myresources.itrevolution.com/id006657137/The-DevOps-Enterprise-Journal-Spring-2022?_ga=2.191177578.1548635363.1652109724-1037911749.1592589043
BTW, I agree!! What a superb episode of @lbmkrishna and @paul_littlefair on @mik podcast! https://projecttoproduct.org/podcast/bank-of-new-zealand/
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🔆 Introducing @ikrnic and @kmusa from CROZ, here to present, Managing the Flow of Value in Service Organizations 🔆
I got a lot of help in crafting this message by @scott.prugh, the community I talked about ❤️
@ikrnic Its important to inject an intake process that uses ANY sort of quantification of what you work on.
And SAYING NO is something we should feel good about! @dominica
16% of opportunities that we said NO to, opened extra capacity for us for strategic work
Definetely a great intiative! Too often we forget the importance of saying "No"
Love the manifesto for sustainable service organizations!
Love your message about community > zero-sum game. Hits very close to heart, as I’m also in a service organisation
@ikrnic Do you work with companies that have a more old school approach to working? How does the cooperation work? Or are these companies considered as "non-strategic"?
Yes, it didn't fit in the talk, but foundational step #1 is forming stable team
That one would probably take an entire talk also 🙂 A very important step in our journey
So you are bringing projects to the teams, instead of people to the projects?
Stable teams, with work flowing to them through kanban board on Flight Level 2
We have been talking about this internally… but it’s a complete shift from our current model, so not easy to get that going…
Can I ask, how big is Croz? How many people do you have?
No, it takes some shift in mindset and it's not easy to operationalize but once done, it's priceless
It is a very cultural shift also… Learning how to pull, instead of waiting for work to be pushed…
How did you go about introducing that change towards stable teams? I feel like you need some critical mass in project / team volumes for things to work in a service organisation… so I have a hard time imagining how this could be driven “bottom-up”/grassroots style.
We try to follow the “stabilise then standardise” approach with these kinds of changes. It started as an experiment (well designed and prepared) with couple of stable teams. And then we learned from that, and scaled out.
And you are right, couple of really big projects that happened along the way helped in gaining the traction and inertia towards the broader rollout of the initiative.
It also helps a lot if you experience some friction along the way when using project teams 🙂 ... And then you prove empirically that stabilizing teams brings benefits, increases knowledge sharing and removes friction
Would definitely recommend "Dynamic Reteaming" by Heidi Helfand for more insights around stable teams
So, are teams responsible for multiple projects at once? Or can you make teams and projects “fit” naturally?
Most teams are responsible for multiple projects and they autonomously organize the work according to their capacity and skillset...
So are teams aligned along tech stacks? Or market segments?
Including conversations around sharing knowledge, removing the bus factor etc.. Some teams are aligned along technology, some are aligned along the client (one large client with multiple initiatives), some are aligned along industry (financial domain knowledge for example)
we tried but didn't find feasible to have only one dimension to align along... and this flexibility works for us so far 🙂
Makes a lot of sense. It would have been my first intuition to align along one dimension, but now that I think about it it’s probably a lot healthier to allow this flexibility in the system.
Would it make sense to organize to increase collaboration/communication within teams and reduce it outside of the team? So that teams get more independant.
Absolutely! We should strive for that: remove handoffs and dependencies to other teams.. I agree
@robert.ruzitschka every organization has its pace, and that's normal, when we feel we're a step ahead, we try to take the role of an "enabling team" and try to share good ideas and see if we can make a step ahead together
The important thing is that there should be a will for change and transformation… so we embark on that journey together.
Thanks @scott.prugh and thanks for your inputs, those were precious!
Thank you for the talk, although I am not personally in the service organization, I found the talk very insightful!
Lot of the concepts you mentioned can definetely be applied to other org/team types (not in the same way, of course).
Thanks, Ivan - Nice. And I think we can have a conversation around the metrics topic :-D
🌟 Excited to introduce our next speakers, @pulak.a.agrawal and Fortune Barnard, here to present Shift Left Security in Ludicrous Mode 🌟
I have another member of our team @tejesh.nandyala as a participant , who made this all happen
@pulak.a.agrawal what does Shift Left Security meant for you ? What were you able to achieve and what left to attain ?
the BIGGEST thing was no change approval board/CAB and wait 6 weeks to speak to humans. This was "we trust the tools and our people"; GO !!.
this was very much the situation with my story earlier about vaccination :-)
yes , I would say as close to exact we can get within devolved administration :D
@siddharth.pareek Anthos, the CMS, the Gitlab tool integration, the caching solution, the pen test failed .. so almost everything 🙂 on actual failures leftover was that the anitvirus solution to be made enterprise version
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