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2020-10-15
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Rikard Ottosson - Psychological Safety (People Not Tech Ltd)18:10:24

Have been looking forward to this talk so much.

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Harsimran, Infosys18:10:43

Super excited to be here for this talk and to listen to Alok Uniyal and Donald Patra on the HSBC Transformation Journey! 🙂

Molly Coyne (Sponsorship Director, ITREV, she/her)18:10:43

Welcome @donaldpatra and @alok_uniyal Uniyal for our next session's Q&A! Thank you to #xpo-infosys!

Harsimran, Infosys18:10:10

Thx Molly! We at Infosys are excited to be here 🙂 !

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Donald Patra18:10:52

Thanks Molly. Pleasure to be here..

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Rajat Sud (DevOps Evangelist - SBPASC, an affiliate of CareFirst) (Speaker)18:10:10

What were some of those behavioral changes that you found yourself undertaking @donaldpatra?

Donald Patra18:10:19

Some of the key changes were around team management, moving away from the centralized to more empowered team model , with lot more autonomy within the teas which later led to teams defining their OKRs and operating as a community.. so the behavior change was to give up the command and control /centralized model over time as the organization matured.

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Harsimran, Infosys18:10:23

True it has been a great partnership between HSBC and Infosys!

Shalini Nair18:10:46

@donaldpatra Great insights ! Do you see the pandemic experience influencing the transformation agenda ?

Donald Patra18:10:22

Interesting observations during the pandemic.. The measures around mean time to recover, release frequencies, shift left etc.. has all shown a favorable trend.. this obviously required a robust remote working collaboration platform.. which we had been ready with

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Steve Boone18:10:44

Hey guys, I'm here to take any questions you have on the Humanizing DevOps Through Data talk!

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Harsimran, Infosys18:10:02

Great session Don and Alok!

Harsimran, Infosys18:10:12

Thanks all for joining!

Molly Coyne (Sponsorship Director, ITREV, she/her)18:10:30

Welcome @steven.boone for our next session's Q&A and thank you to #xpo-hcl-software-devops!

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Andy Nelson18:10:39

Hi @steven.boone ! (I forgot to switch slack channel when your talk started)

Steve Boone18:10:16

Hey @isuanelson - no worries, thats for coming and listening in!

Jess Meyer - IT Revolution (she/her)18:10:41

Anyone having audio trouble listening to @steven.boone’s talk?

Steve Boone18:10:06

I blame the audio guy 😄

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Steve Boone18:10:07

Hey @jtf! Hope you are doing well pal!

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Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:50

@steven.boone while you’re talking about the unplanned work, I noticed recently how synchronous most companies still operate even after 6 months of lock down. Asynchronous as opposite should help to accelerate but also to be able to operate more independent. Do you see this as a next step for large enterprises as well to remove “waiting time” for example?

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Steve Boone19:10:46

I think the key is that regardless if teams are working synchronous or asynchronous, that they are able to know who is working on what. I think the main benefit the data provides is that visiiblity. BRB, apologies, my kid is crying - "new normal"

Steve Boone19:10:05

I think if we really want to reduce "waiting time" we need to know a few things. • what are we waiting for • where does it get helped up?

Steve Boone19:10:27

If we know those things, we can start asking the important questions, and hopefully getting to the "how do we move it along"

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:55

yeah, thats true, and in particular when new large projects start the what are we waiting for is sometimes harder to work out in detail in case everyone is remote and not coming together in one room like we did before, that is probably where some of the struggle is coming from

Andy Nelson19:10:00

👏 - Good talk Steve

upvotepartyparrot 1
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Ganga Narayanan19:10:34

Loved the 5-point presentation! Simple, concise and powerful! Thank you Steve!

Scott Fererro19:10:01

Great talk. Thanks Steve

Steve Boone19:10:12

Feel free to ping me if you want to have any follow up conversations.

Molly Coyne (Sponsorship Director, ITREV, she/her)19:10:37

Welcome @andreas.prins for our next session's Q&A and thank you to #xpo-digitalai-accelerates-software-delivery!

dario debarbieri19:10:40

Great talk Steve! 👏

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:15

thank you, always a bit weird to tune in to your own talk 🙂

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Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:39

what is the technical state of your apps, or components of the apps that need to be addressed. Having a clear view of this for all your teams is super helpful to see the bigger picture

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:16

we’ve learned that making this visual is helpful because architecture is often so abstract and not visible

Rajat Sud (DevOps Evangelist - SBPASC, an affiliate of CareFirst) (Speaker)19:10:43

Great idea! Love the observability - big picture/small details, all on the same page

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Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure19:10:58

@andreas.prins This also helps the team feel better about not automating themselves out of a job, it helps them feel like they are shaping their future job.

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:54

that is sometimes a true fear indeed. Until they discover that freeing up time to focus on real development they feel 10x motivated

Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure19:10:18

yeah, I often got the question during 1:1 and then after they were able to have free time to work on the more fun projects, I tend to ask them the question back, do they feel that they are less needed or more needed now? they say more need because the new projects are important and they are not doing repetitive work now…

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Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:13

fun thing we learned, sometimes little side projects from motivated and engaged colleagues often deliver the greatest value for the future

Rajat Sud (DevOps Evangelist - SBPASC, an affiliate of CareFirst) (Speaker)19:10:51

How do you balance self-service with rules, checks and balances? For instance, if I give my teams the independence to create their own pipelines, how do I ensure that they've got Sonar scans enabled as a part of the CI process?

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Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:43

that is a really nice question, I’ve struggled with this while managing my teams, but also many of our customers.

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:38

I’m now at a point that I do believe some mandatory components can be there, next to all the freedom that is for example tech specific. If you love to learn how our product support this, feel free to ask in #xpo-digitalai-accelerates-software-delivery

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:52

some of my colleagues will be happy to give a demo and explain this fine grained balance

Rich B - DevOps is my career change19:10:33

same with cloud resources, i want to give them autonomy to create resources in a dev env but how do we know they are properly securing?

Manny Avila - Consulting Engineer, Cloud and Datacenter - JD Finish Line19:10:47

we have learned we can't give developers that much latitude...we are building out a semi-automated pipeline that allows some variability, but comes with manditory components...

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Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:04

yeah that is a good one, I believe more modern frameworks like OPA (open Policy agent) for these type of resources can be very usefull and actually required

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:34

this was a blog post I was looking for

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:40

a bit older but describing that balance

Aras Kaleda/Change Manager19:10:43

if the deployment went successfully, what would you recommend to search and what data to look for in the monitoring ?

Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure19:10:26

would that be where VSM comes in looking for the bottle neck..

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:16

certainly, data is crucial in this, we’re as a company actively developing a lot of “lenses” to look into the process, understand the flow etc.

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:14

value stream management, or value stream insights I do believe are the most valuable if you know your goals, and if the chain from goal to strories and tasks are nicely planned

Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure19:10:58

agreed… great job breaking this down and providing a framework…

Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure19:10:04

We also looked at hand-offs as waste and where we can find some key wins for automations…

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:10

I once proposed (by that time in ING bank highly regulated) to turn it upside down and proposed to have a 100% pipe from commit to deployment in prod. That was impossible for many people just in their imagination, however, even CISO and other security departments changed their mind when they discovered what is possible. The funny fact, by setting this goal, it resulted in zero handovers at the end of the journey

Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure19:10:07

agreed, we had the same conversation with our InfoSec team wanting division of labor, showing that if we automate, then there is less hands that need to be watched, and the audit process is easier to set up..

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:41

other funny fact, it was ultimately the business owner of the application that was starting the releases to prod. Knowing that with all the automated tests, quality gates etc… if it did not break it was of good enough quality (combined with monitoring) that was enough for infosec team since “business” was involved that way

Denver Martin - Sr. Mgr Cloud Ops Infrastructure20:10:32

that is the best, so you would override and accept your own risk… lol

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:46

enjoy the day! it’s 10 in the evening in Europe… will answer more questions tomorrow morning my time 🙂

Andreas Prins VP Product Strategy Digital.ai19:10:59

or just go to #xpo-digitalai-accelerates-software-delivery for all our colleagues

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Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:00

Hi. I am here to answer any questions about my Atlassian session: Crushing Incidents with DevOps Agility. Let me know if you have any comments or questions.

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Molly Coyne (Sponsorship Director, ITREV, she/her)20:10:23

Welcome @dhenry2 for our next session's Q&A! And thank you to #xpo-atlassian!!

archana kataria20:10:54

Devops is an agile version of ITIL in my mind

archana kataria20:10:04

we need processes to run at the speed we want to

archana kataria20:10:33

ITIL has a bad rep because it tends to come across as process heavy and not friendly to speed (but they have the same mission)

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Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:57

Maybe it's a company maturity (yeah I know) where they have always been different

archana kataria20:10:11

learn = RCA = problem management as a example...same thing different terminology

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:59

Yeah, but they have always cycled differently, with Problem being the "handoff" between the two

archana kataria20:10:38

not sure I understand ITIL is a full loop as well ITIL V4 is adopting more agile approach

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:35

Incidents group to Problem which could cause a Change, with Known Error and Knowledge Base being in there as well.

Ravi Tharisayi20:10:02

Agree with you @bwilliams4 that there’s a lot of linkages between the practices. It can also be that a change is linked to an incident. One of the areas Atlassian’s product team has been investing in is giving you visibility into recent changes (such as a view deploys from Bitbucket when swarming on an incident.)

Ravi Tharisayi20:10:35

@archana_kataria - You raise a great point about ITIL. Our team at Atlassian recently did a deep dive on ITIL 4, the most recent release of ITIL and noted quite a lot of influence from agile methodologies. https://www.atlassian.com/whitepapers/itil4

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archana kataria20:10:34

the challenge that we are facing is the complexity of the systems and how to observe them

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archana kataria20:10:49

so we can respond to them and identify what to restore

Aras Kaleda/Change Manager20:10:54

is this integrated with mainframe ?

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:50

Hi Aras. Sorry which area are you talking about.

Aras Kaleda/Change Manager20:10:37

I mean can it be integrated so that it would catch mainframe alerts

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:48

Yes, we have a tool called edge connector which enables you to connect your infrastructure and applications behind the firewall to Opsgenie.

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:08

We also have a layer of encryption that can be applied.

Ruta Kalediene20:10:51

If it can be connected with mainframe, then is there a change management module also?

Eduardo Rodrigues Semensati (Procter and Gamble)20:10:49

do the devops metrics retrieve information from GitHub and Jenkins as well, or only Atlassian products out of the box?

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:06

We have integrations on our roadmap with GitHub. You can use our api to help tie deployments to incidents.

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:11

RCA on every Incident? Wasn't the goal of Incident to restore service and then with Problem do RCA and then plan for removal?

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:47

Something change somewhere with what I know....

Brad Nelson20:10:54

@dhenry2 audio was so good. You should voice more videos 😆

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archana kataria20:10:03

we do RCA for high priority incidents

archana kataria20:10:10

I think RCA shuold be done for any incident

archana kataria20:10:20

there are learnings with every incident

Eduardo Rodrigues Semensati (Procter and Gamble)20:10:28

we are currently piloting OpsGenie and StatusPage, so it was a good quick sessions overview for me. Integration to other CI/CD tools for measuring metrics out of the box is key. Not sure if you folks saw the open source repo from Google on the Four Keys, but that would be exactly what we are looking for

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:31

Yes agreed, but in may cases in Dev a feature flag, or rollback is the path to resolution. But you are right, it also helps with problem management

archana kataria20:10:11

@dhenry2 those are the actions we want but we are sometimes challenged with multiple services that are in the workflow that is experiencing outages to pinpoint who is the issue is a challenge

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:35

I've worked in places that had an "Incident" every 1.6s, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:15

It was a vast system across the globe.

archana kataria20:10:32

also would be curious to understand opinions/feedback on alerts

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:42

I agree, we are simply trying to raise more info to the response team. One thing I did not show is that we can also suscribe to all of our 3rd party services that use statuspage. So we can help determine if a incident is caused by a 3rd party service failure.

archana kataria20:10:42

with so many permutations to fail how do u write alerts

Darren Henry at Atlassian20:10:28

we have over 200 integration and have api, webhooks, and email. so many of our customers are using Atlassian’s Opsgenie to centralize alerts from their entire stack. Then they user our rules engine to prioritize and in many cases ignore the noise.

archana kataria21:10:23

too much data with noise drives alert fatigue also does not solve the problem of one cannot predict every failure scenario

Darren Henry at Atlassian21:10:22

Right that is why we use our rules engine to sift through the noise. We also can group alerts and delay notification in case the alert is flapping.

archana kataria20:10:48

not humanly possible

Ben Williams - Arvest Bank - Sr Data Pipeline Dev20:10:03

You can't do RCA at that rate, that is why you have Problem

Virginia Laurenzano NSA (Speaker)20:10:44

how does (or doesn't) OpsGenie respect the groupings CSUM gives large entities access to?

Darren Henry at Atlassian21:10:15

@vmshook sorry I don’t understand your question.

Virginia Laurenzano NSA (Speaker)21:10:55

we'll just ping our TEM 🙂 we've been bitten by plug-ins not playing well together and our customers rely on CSUM for group management

Darren Henry at Atlassian21:10:09

@vmshook if you would like to speak with someone more technical, DM me, I am not familiar with CSUM.

Darren Henry at Atlassian21:10:04

@vmshook I just found out the answer. Opsgenie does not respect the CSUM grouping. The users should be easily accessed, but we do not use the grouping when defining response teams.

Nick - developer at BNPP21:10:30

Is the presentation live on track 4? I see only "get together/go faster" screen. Tried refreshing the chrome tab

Nick - developer at BNPP21:10:29

thanks, I will watch it from the library then.

Darren Henry at Atlassian21:10:20

Here is the link to Atlassian’s Incident Management Handbook I mentioned in the presentation. https://www.atlassian.com/incident-management/get-the-handbook